User talk:Shran/PageII

Confirmed/Presumed Dead
I like that section. You might want to add a few characters to it though:

To the confirmed dead, I'd add: The original Kahless, Degra, Major Hayes, Dolim, Silik, Maxwell Forrest, Khan Noonien Singh, David Marcus, Noonian Soong, K'mpec, K'Ehleyr, Duras, son of Ja'rod, Lore, Kang, Koloth, Lursa, B'Etor, Bareil Antos, Seska, Michael Eddington, Gowron, Luther Sloan, and Joseph Carey.

To the presumed dead, I'd add the following:
 * Lily Sloane: Would be well over 300.
 * Duras, son of Toral: Based on visual evidence in "The Expanse".
 * Elizabeth Cutler: Would be well over 200 and based on actress Kellie Waymire's death
 * Arik Soong: Would be well over 200.
 * Shran: Would be well over 200 and there's no evidence Andorians live any longer than humans.
 * Soval: Would be well over 200, probably over 300, based on lines in certain episodes such as "Cease Fire".
 * Flint: Based on evidence in and the death of actor James Daly
 * Christopher Pike: Would probably be over 150 and based on actor Jeffrey Hunter's death.
 * Zefram Cochrane: No longer rejuvinated by the Companion, he'd likely age as normal humans did.
 * T'Pau: Would be 260, much older than Sarek was at the time of his death, and much older than the Vulcan life-span of 200 given in "Broken Bow" (I'm inclined to presume T'Pol, who would be 294, to be deceased for the same reason). Also, I believe T'Pau was referred to in the past tense in )
 * Richard Daystrom: Would be 163 and based on the death of actor William Marshall.
 * Carol Marcus: Based on her presumed age (around Kirk's age or not much younger) and the death of actress Bibi Besch.
 * Amanda Grayson: Based on her presumed age (would be at least 172, if she was 20 when Spock was born) and absense in the episode "Sarek".
 * Kor: Based on visual evidence in the episode "Once More Unto the Breach" and the death of actor John Colicos.

To the unkown, I'd add:
 * Surak: Surak's body died of radiation poisoning over two millenia ago, but his katra was preserved until at least 2154. We don't know what happened to it after it was transferred from Archer to the Vulcan priest.
 * Toral, son of Duras: He fell in battle with Worf in "The Sword of Kahless" but it's unclear if he was killed or not.
 * Weyoun: The female changeling said Weyoun-8 was his last clone but it's unclear if a new one could have been activated later or not.
 * The Borg Queen: Much like Weyoun, you can kill her and she keeps coming back. However, the pathogen, introduced into the Borg Collective by Admiral Janeway, appeared to be quite devastating, however.  It's unclear if enough of the Collective endured to activate a new queen.

Also: Harry Mudd would certainly be well over 100 but not quite over 200. --T smitts 02:22, 26 Aug 2005 (UTC)


 * Wow... many of those I hadn't even thought of. Thanks for the suggestions, I'll put them to good use ASAP! ;) See you... out there! --From Andoria with Love 05:27, 26 Aug 2005 (UTC)

Small note about deceased
I just figured I'd add Enabran Tain to the list of deceased mentioned above.

Also, to the presumed dead, I might consider adding Ishka, based on the death of Cecily Adams. (Or maybe not, since Andrea Martin is still alive.)--T smitts 08:48, 29 Aug 2005 (UTC)


 * Geez, you're really into this, aren't you? LOL! Anyways, thanks for the suggestion; I'll be sure to add them sometime in the near future. ;) --From Andoria with Love 08:54, 29 Aug 2005 (UTC)

A Quick Correction
Just a slight correction: Degra, Hayes, Dolim, and Forrest all died in 2154, not 2155. And Kor, not Koloth, survived the final battle with the Albino.--T smitts 06:14, 26 Aug 2005 (UTC)
 * I caught my mistake with Kor/Koloth. I'll correct the years, though. Good catch! Thanks for letting me know. :) See you... out there! --From Andoria with Love 06:45, 26 Aug 2005 (UTC)

Another quick note
How did I miss this? Just thought I'd add Tora Ziyal to the list of confirmed dead. (While I'm adding this, I also might suggest you take a close look at the years mentioned in Carol Marcus' entry and the last sentence of Scotty's entry.)--T smitts 07:06, 26 Aug 2005 (UTC)
 * I took care of the errors; Thanks for pointing them out. I'll also add Ziyal sometime soon. Again, many thanks! See you... out there! --From Andoria with Love 07:18, 26 Aug 2005 (UTC)

Just one more addition...
Just figured I'd throw in one more addition before turning in for the night: In the "unknown" section, I'd add Dmitri Valtane, given his apparent death in "Flashback" but his appearance, alive and well at the end of Star Trek VI. (The most glaring flaw in that episode, but certainly not the only one! Grrrr!)--T smitts 08:52, 26 Aug 2005 (UTC)

Dead list
Nice to see you back again. Any chance you'll be updating the deceased list tonight?--T smitts 07:10, 28 Aug 2005 (UTC)
 * Coincidently, I'm doing it right now, beginning with Dmitri Valtane. ;) --From Andoria with Love 07:12, 28 Aug 2005 (UTC)

Nice update
Nice update. One thing: T'Pol would be 294, not 316 in 2382.--T smitts 08:07, 28 Aug 2005 (UTC)
 * Ah, you're right. For some reason, I thought she was born in 2066... but she said she was 66 years old in 2154, making it a birthyear of 2088. It was due to the 66 part, more-than-likely. Thanks for catching that. :) --From Andoria with Love 08:11, 28 Aug 2005 (UTC)

Nice.. a few more...
I'm really getting into this. And a few more:

Confirmed Dead:


 * Elizabeth: Lived a tragically short life because of a flaw in the cloning technique used by Paxton's doctors. (sniff!)


 * Tolian Soran: The good doctor experienced a little of the old ultra-violence when Picard sabotaged his missile launcher.


 * Naomi Wildman: Died of complications moments after birth thanks to the actions of an alternate Voyager. Replaced by an identical baby from the alternate Voyager to live on and grow up ridiculously fast.  (I suppose you could say this might not have been Naomi really since her mom may not have picked a name yet.)


 * Keevan: Everyone’s second-favorite Vorta was fatally wounded by a shot from Gaila meant for Quark. His dying words were an understandable “I hate Ferengi”.  Keevan’s indignity did not end there, however, as his corpse was reanimated long enough to rescue Ishka and capture Yelgrun.  He was last seen repeatedly walking into a wall.

Unknown:
 * John Harriman: Ah, whatever happened to the captain of the Enterprise-B? Given his excessive caution, I'm betting he lived to a ripe old age.


 * Demora Sulu: If McCoy can make it to at least 137, I'm betting she can make at least 111.


 * Richard Castillo: The Enterprise-C's de facto captain apparently did "make it one for the history books" at Narendra III as the late Captain Garrett promised. Did he survive however?  Was he captured like Yar or killed?


 * Ro Laren: What DID happen to Star Trek's first Bajoran after she went AWOL to join the Maquis. Was she wiped out by the Dominion with most of the others or did she live?  (Between Star Trek and 24, Michelle Forbes has developed a nasty habit of leaving the fate of her characters up in the air...)


 * Arridor and Kol: Fans had to wait seven years to find out what happened to those pesky Ferengi after they got stranded in the Delta Quadrant. We've now been waiting even longer to find out what happened after they fell through the Barzan wormhole again.

(Also there MAY have been another Borg Queen death when the Borg Queen's vessel was destroyed at the end of .)

Live Long and Prosper... cont'd
Good going with the additions. Nice to see the little gag got in. If you care, here's a few more:

Confirmed Dead:


 * T'Les: Dies in her daughter's arms after her Six Feet Under co-star carpet-bombs the T'Karath Sanctuary.


 * Talas: Succumbs to phase-pulse infection after the trigger-happy Naarg shoots her in the shoulder.


 * Gary Mitchell and Elizabeth Dehner: The guy who could control anything with his mind but still couldn't remember his friend's middle name was entombed in the grave meant for Kirk (Dehner died right after, apparently from exhaustion helping Kirk beat him).


 * Clark Terrell: Vaporized himself with a phaser to get rid of that damn ear slug (maybe he should have tried a Q-tip first).


 * Kruge: Kicked off a cliff into a river of lava (in a very unconvincing effect) by Kirk, who had apparently had enough of him.


 * Gorkon: The Klingon Chancellor's attempts at peace were cut short when he was assassinated by Burke and Samno.


 * Chang: "To be or not to be..." Chang evidentally chose the latter when he went up against the Enterprise-A and Excelsior over Khitomer.


 * Dexter Remmick: Fans everywhere were grossed out when Picard and Riker blew up his head to get at the nasty alien inside.


 * Lore: Data's evil brother was shot, deactivated, disassembled, melted down, and made in to commemorative coins. (Okay, okay.  I embellished a bit on the last part)


 * Hogan: Eaten by a giant worm-thing on Hanon IV. His bones were later used to prove dinosaurs live in the Delta Quadrant.


 * Lon Suder: Shot in the back by a Kazon while helping The Doctor and Tom Paris retake the ship, only to be reincarnated in a young boy's doll. (Just kidding!)


 * Matthew Dougherty: The Admiral's career came to an abrupt end when Ru'afo strapped him into the Son'a's face stretching machine and gave him the Joan Rivers special.


 * Ru'afo: His stretched ass was blown to hell when Picard blew up his collector.


 * Mila: Garak's childhood nanny was thrown down a flight of stairs by Jem'Hadar soldiers, which at her age, could be pretty hazardous. (I know, I know.  She was probably dead already at this point.)


 * Reman Viceroy: Dropped to the bottom of a Jefferies tube during a fight with Riker.


 * Shinzon: The Picard wannabe is impaled with a pole during a fight with the real deal (though he was already dying).

Presumed Dead:


 * Vina: She was an adult when the SS Columbia crashed on Talos IV in 2236. If we assume an age of thirty that would make her 176 (The Talosians can create the illusion of youth but apparently not actual youth).  Plus the death of Susan Oliver.


 * Dr. Philip Boyce: The was obviously north of fifty in, circa 2254 which would make him at least 180 or so, plus the death of John Hoyt.


 * Dr. Mark Piper: He was probably about a decade younger than Boyce (the looked about the same age and "Where No Man..." took place nine years after "The Cage"), which would make him around 170 or so, plus the death of Paul Fix.


 * Ishka: Based on the death of Cecily Adams.

Unknown:
 * Number One: We know next to nothing about Pike's raven-haired XO, including her name and when or if she died.


 * Willard Decker and Ilia: both apparently were merged with/consumed by V'Ger. Ilia, if she was still alive, presumably somehow died later to coincide with the passing of Persis Khambatta.


 * I was gonna get to the movie deaths later on; the others I hadn't thought about yet. Thanks again! :) --From Andoria with Love 09:37, 6 Sep 2005 (UTC)
 * Just noticed the Lon Suder/Brad Dourif/Chucky the doll reference. That made my day... er, morning, lol! --From Andoria with Love 09:39, 6 Sep 2005 (UTC)
 * Joan Rivers special! Dude, I'm using that one, lol! --From Andoria with Love 09:42, 6 Sep 2005 (UTC)
 * You like that one. It was either that or "gave Extreme Makeover a whole new meaning."
 * Ah, I like the Joan Rivers one better. ;) Also, I'll be moving these comments to the talk page on User talk:Shran/PageII, so you can post any further comments and suggestions on this topic over there. :) --From Andoria with Love 09:59, 6 Sep 2005 (UTC)

...And still a few more:
Confirmed Dead:
 * Henry Archer: Died of advanced Clarke's Disease in 2124 before the Warp 5 engine he worked on became a reality (though not before he dug up his backyard and creeped out all his neighbours on Wysteria Lane).


 * A.G. Robinson: The first human to break the Warp 2 barried died in a climbing accident at Mt. McKinley in 2152.


 * Duras, son of Toral: Aw, come on. We all saw the end of .  He was blown to bits and he ain't comin' back (though presumably not before having at least one kid).


 * Jack Crusher: Died in some sort of disaster in 2364 when Jean-Luc Picard chose to save someone else, though he would continue to appear to his wife and son in the form of holograms, vision quests, and hallucinations brought on by telepathic memory invasions.


 * Jennifer Sisko: Died on the USS Saratoga at the Battle of Wolf 359, leaving her husband with crippling angst for the next three years.


 * Curzon Dax: Not sure whether to include him or not, but we've heard so much about him, I feel like he is a major character, even if we hardly saw him (same with Henry Archer).


 * K'mpec: Died from a cumulative poinson slipped into his bloodwine over several months. (Was it Duras or someone else?  We may never know.)

Presumed dead:
 * Silva La Forge: If whatever made the USS Hera disappear didn't her, than something else probably did by 2372 to conincide with the death of Madge Sinclair.


 * Emory Erickson: He'd be well over 300. The man invented the transporter, not a cure for old age (or did he, if you consider Montgomery Scott?)


 * Porthos: Much as I love the pooch, he'd be well over 300 which is about 237,496,541,980 in dog years. (FYI, that just a random number.  I have no idea how much it actually would be, nor do I care).


 * Flint: Based on what we saw in and the death of actor James Daly


 * T'Pau: Would be 260, and based on the death of Celia Lovsky.


 * Boothby: The famous Starfleet Academy groundskeeper probably died around 2377 to coincide with the death of Ray Walston.

Unknown:
 * Kevin Riley: Last seen in. He'd probably be close to (but not quite) 150.


 * Azetbur: She was definately no longer Chancellor by 2366 when K'mpec held the title, and from what we've seen Klingon chancellors only seem to leave office feet first. Could Azetbur be an exception?  I don't know.


 * Kai Opaka: Though she was brought back to life after dying on a moon, she can never leave, just like the warring inhabitants. What became of her?  Was that actually her was saw in Sisko's vision in ?


 * The Female Changeling. She agreed to stand trial for war crimes at the end of the Dominion War.  The Klingons and Romulans (and the Cardassians, for that matter) would probably all be calling for her execution.  Presumably, that's not standard Federation policy, but would they make an exception for the sake of diplomacy?  Who can say?

i have a question, i think i am posting it in the right place, if not i am very sorry. my question is how do i set up a custom signature like yours.

i want mine to say, as stoicly as txt gets, Its Time For The White!

thank you for any help you may give, either post the answer here or on my page. KetracelWhiteJunkie 21:35, 21 February 2006 (UTC)

Molly's Age
Quite an...interesting theory you have there about Molly's age; not sure I agree with it, but seeing as how I can't come up with anything better...anyway, there are a couple problems. Presumably, this incident that you speak of where they were trapped in space for 2 years happened when they were on their way to DS9 from the Enterprise? Here's the thing though...the Enterprise dropped them off at DS9. so it would have had to have happened during the transporter beam, I guess; and I can't even remember if Miles, Keiko, and Molly all beamed down together or not. Furthermore, though...Molly appeared to be about 4 years old in too, which was in TNG Season 6, when she would only have been about one year old and before Miles transferred to DS9. So...whatever happened, whenever it happened, it had to have happened when they were all still on the Enterprise. And the fact that Dr. Crusher would not have noticed that a baby had just suddenly aged 3 years in a matter of seconds is...quite odd, to say the least.

Certainly a nice try though. ;-) --Antodav 05:12, 5 June 2006 (UTC)


 * I never said it happened on O'Brien's way to DS9, just sometime between Molly's birth and O'Brien's re-assignment to DS9. If I stated oterwise, I didn't mean to. So, it's still a possibility that something odd occured off-screen between the events of and . --From Andoria with Love 18:12, 5 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Molly's age has to do with some genetic characteristics. You know, klingon children mature faster than humans, eg. Alexander. This would mean the future Irish children will also mature faster.

Human/Klingon first contact
I don't think the references conflict at all, if you read them all in context with each other.

We have First Contact in "Broken Bow", where Archer (however well intentioned) gets humans "off on the wrong foot" by denying Klaang (?) his honorable death as a warrior in service to the Empire. Over the next however many years, humans continue to interact with Klingons without really understanding them, and generally rubbing them the wrong way (as shown in various eps of "Enterprise").

While not seeming to be all that bad at the time, analysis by future historians would show just how deeply mistaken that impression was (to use Picard's term: "disasterous"), and the concept of covertly studying a culture before interacting with it would be developed.

Some time during the 2220's, something big happens that finally pushes the Klingons too far, and a 70 year long state of hostilities (a combination of "hot" and "cold" warfare) begins that will not end until the Praxis Incident makes it impossible for the Klingons to sustain it further.

At least that makes sense to me...Capt Christopher Donovan 12:48, 13 December 2006 (UTC)


 * Isn't that what I said on the page? :P --From Andoria with Love 01:56, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

It seemed to me when I read your entry that you were uncomfortable with harmonizing the various references and thought some of them incompatable. I apologize for misreading you... :) Capt Christopher Donovan 09:12, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Romulans...
Nice explanation for the foreheads I have to say. I'd agree with that.

There's only one thing that's bothering me with that whole thing... Valdore and the other romulans from 2154 wore the same uniforms that were seen in ST:X Nemesis. Hm. How would you explain that? The only explanation I have is that the Romulans from 2379 got nostalgic and liked the old fashion so they reinvented it.

I'm looking forward to your idea hehe... ~ Trent _ Easton  ~ talk
 * I personally go for the nostalgic route. I mean, haven't you ever wanted to dress up as a minuteman from the 13 colonies? --OuroborosCobra talk 12:31, 1 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Eh... maybe they were also involved in the Temporal Cold War and had their own mysterious benefactor from the future. Only, instead of giving them genetic enhancements, he gave them tips of how Romulans dress for success in the 24th century. :P --From Andoria with Love 12:35, 1 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I think you may be suffering from temporal psychosis :P --OuroborosCobra talk 12:40, 1 January 2007 (UTC)